Law Firm Marketing

Ep 57 – Legal Marketing In Splitsville

Alternative legal services, DIY Legal in the palm of your hand, and then a chat with Erin Levine of on listening to your clients, creating useful content and resources plus what it takes to successfully market a family law firm in Splitsville.

legal marketing for family law firms


Is The Future Law Firm Going To Be Like Uber? Legal Services On Demand

There are two articles in today’s Hot Take, and we’re looking at the future of legal consumers and legal product offerings in both. What’s the future look like when companies like LegalZoom and RocketLawyer are already gaining popularity? In the first article,  “There’s No Need To Hire A Lawyer When These Sites Let You Do It Yourself ” by Dawn Kawamoto we look directly at and compare the service offerings of the above mentioned online legal service providers, as well as several others. It’s good to know just what you can get these days, as well as what the expectations are and the outcomes – even though this one seems to take a bit less-than-favorable view of these things, stating,”…folks would be better off hiring an attorney if their needs stray beyond the simplest will…fast and cheap apparently doesn’t always work.” Fortunately our guest Erin Levine has a solution to this! You can read that one here:

Article number two is “The Future Of Legal Services: Putting A Law Firm In The Palm Of Your Hand” by Jeff Bell – important to note that Jeff is the CEO of LegalShield, which is a subscription law service. This one presents the idea of more app-based or project-based services, and in general has a much more favorable approach as well as some guidelines. Jeff also states,”First, let’s state the obvious: Lawyers are not known for customer service.” This can be a problem when customer service and access are what will separate you from the field in his opinion, and the whole idea of a lot of his approach is much more “customer-first” but he can back it up, so worth checking out here:

Bay Area Family Lawyer and Web Developer Extraordinaire

Erin Levine has been working for 14 years advising clients, litigating, negotiating and mediating contested and cooperative divorces, and running the respected boutique family law firm Levin Family Law in the Bay Area. In 2018, Erin snagged the grand prize at the Duke Law & Tech Accelerator Program. She is also the founder and CEO of Hello Divorce. a service that empowers clients to manage their separations online with easy to follow, step-by-step guidance and affordable access to top-notch lawyers. We are honored to have this opportunity to sit with Erin to chat about love and law on the LAWsome podcast.

Erin Levine

From Idea To Reality

In this excerpt from the podcast Jake and Paul talk with Erin about what was behind the initial idea for HelloDivorce and some of the early changes she made that based on user feedback:

Jake:  … So, in that quest to be the tour guide and lay things out in an easy to understand way, you have membership options, you have legal coaching as an option at Hello Divorce, there’s a pay-as-you go kind of plan. So, the drive to adopt those options, unpack that a little bit more in regards to Hello Divorce and how you have then transitioned that market research into what you’re offering there.

Erin: Initially, Hello Divorce was part of my law firm. So, I didn’t have to really worry about the ethics rules in regards to like unauthorized practice of law and what is legal advice versus what isn’t. So, I started that way. As of January 1, 2019, I now have two separate companies. But at the time, I really wanted to focus on getting a great product out there and great options out there that didn’t necessarily, you know, fall into one category or the other. I just wanted to see if there was a consumer demand. And so, initially, my biggest mistake was I offered way too many options. Users told me that they were excited about the options but super confused, they had no idea what to choose. They had enough pain points and new issues in their own personal lives to deal with. They kind of wanted me to direct them as to what it is that they needed as opposed to just, “Here are the options, pick what you need.” Because people just didn’t know what they needed.

What they do know is whether or not they’re willing to do something more do-it-yourself, whether or not they prefer to have somebody just pick it up and do it for them, and whether or not they need legal advice or strategy. So, they know that pretty quickly on. And so, we redesigned about six months after launch and shifted our focus to these membership options, wherein we also offer a la Carte services but it’s not like our main focus. Generally, what happens is if somebody purchases like a legal document [for] assisted divorce, at some point, they might need some legal help. And at that point, the legal document assistant will be like, “Here’s the link to purchase two to three hours of one of our lawyer’s time and you can use it however you want. You can email, you can Zoom video chat, you can have her review your documents and revise them. But it sounds like at this point in your divorce, it might make sense for you to have a couple hours of a la Carte services.”

Get More Information About Legal Marketing, DIY Legal Services and Online Product Development

Be sure to listen to the entire podcast episode for more insights and conversation about legal marketing, DIY legal services and online product development. If you want more LAWsome subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast platform, and for the latest in legal marketing insights and information be sure to subscribe to the Consultwebs Newsletter here –>SUBSCRIBE<—


Ep 55 – Marketing In and Out of the Courtroom

Today we talk about the power of visual in marketing with an article from Hubspot, and then we sit down with Aaron Birk and Irma Hawkins from DK Global to discuss the impact illustration and visual marketing have in trial law, and how lawyers can use social media more authentically.

law firm marketing in court








Visual Marketing for Law Firms – Some Statistics

Today’s Hot Take is an article from HubSpot called “45 Visual Content Marketing Statistics You Should Know in 2018,”  by Jesse Mawhinney. It is an enumerated list – Paul’s favorite! – that is broken out in to different categories, such as social media and video. While all 45 points are not exclusively directed towards law firm marketing, many translate well, and we have a few favorites we highlighted:

“When people hear information, they’re likely to remember only 10% of that information three days later. However, if a relevant image is paired with that same information, people retained 65% of the information three days later.

People following directions with text and illustrations do 323% better than people following directions without illustrations.

Gaming, education, and healthcare are the top three industries expected to invest the most in VR technology for business growth.”

It’s a great article and we recommend checking it out – and it really delivers on what may or may not be an obvious point – people relate to and understand things better if there is a visual attached.  Read all 45 points for yourself here

A One-Two Legal Marketing Punch

DK Global is a full-service interactive media provider that helps legal teams express themselves in a clear, compelling, and accurate way. Since 1998, DK Global has provided animations, illustrations and other compelling marketing solutions to civil, criminal, plaintiff, and defense attorneys, along with several governmental entities, in thousands of trials.

With us today is DK Global’s Aaron Birk, Social Media Strategist and Irma Hawkins Marketing Coordinator – Aaron has worked as a digital content provider for private corporate agencies and as an investigative travel journalist and columnist for print and web publications.

Irma Hawkins has an extensive history in the anime and video game industry – and together they are bringing their marketing acumen to the lawsome podcast.

“Bringing a visual either induces a quick settlement or impacts the verdict at the end of a trial.”

In this excerpt from the podcast Jake and Paul talk with Aaron and Irma about how much of a difference visual in the courtroom can make, why it’s important to do them properly and what’s involved  in “courtroom marketing”:

Irma: So, I don’t know if you know, but I get to interview a lot of attorneys as part of my job responsibilities. It’s an awesome one. I get to go and meet a lot of the attorneys whenever they settle a case or they get a verdict, favorably. A lot of the things that I hear is that it is one of the most stressful situations for them is when they’re in trial, and the last thing they need to worry about is issues with one of their contractors. So, what our aim is, is to make this process as easy as possible for the attorneys in such difficult moments…and to make it easier for them to help their client, as opposed to wasting time with [contractors]. And so, when we work with the attorneys, we work close with their experts. We request operative reports from the beginning, the police reports, and any other materials that they may have in order for us to create custom content.

Aaron: I think a big one here, guys, is that, you know, you have to be dedicated to the accuracy of bringing a visual that you’re going to bring into court [because of]…court admissibility reasons. But the big thing is that the reason that you want to do that form of…you’d call it trial marketing, I suppose, is that living in a more visual world and understanding the spatial reality of something that occurred, an accident or a collision, you know, something like that, is an important thing to show people, rather than just talking about an event. And so, showing someone an accurate representation of what happened can vastly impact the outcome of a trial, and I think that more and more attorneys are learning that bringing a visual either induces a quick settlement or impacts the verdict at the end of a trial. We’re seeing that all the time.

Jacob: That’s amazing to hear you say and looking through at some of the work that you had posted as samples on your site, it’s incredibly thorough. And it strikes me that…we’ve had lawyers on the show and people who are really into self-promotion and stuff like that, and one thing they’ve told us is that everything when you walk into a courtroom is marketing: your suit, how you present yourself, all that stuff. And so… I mean, this is a real difference maker. This isn’t just, like, “Hey, we slapped some stuff up on some slides.” You’re talking about a professional presentation that’s going to win or lose a case, in some cases.

Aaron: Well, we’ll pull in certified experts that work on this stuff. If you’re going to bring a visual into a courtroom, it has to be as accurate as possible. Obviously,  opposing counsel is going to say,”That’s not how it happened,” so it needs to be as perfect as possible. One of the interesting things about that is that, if it is admitted, that alone is its own sort of marketing, that this has been admitted into court as a demonstrative exhibit. Right? And people have faith in that, and so what you’re showing them a surgical animation or a medical illustration or, you know, labeled slides and things like that, it becomes all that much more powerful for conveying your argument.

Jacob: And it’s one of those things, too. Like we tell a lot of our clients, when it comes to video, that … when it’s done right, it’s seamless. When it’s done wrong, it’s terrible, and everybody notices.

Get More Information About Marketing In and Out of the Courtroom

Be sure to listen to the entire podcast episode for more insights and thoughts about visual strategies for the courtroom and how to take advantage of marketing  opportunities that may present themselves in places you don’t expect. If you want more LAWsome subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast platform, and for the latest in legal marketing insights and information be sure to subscribe to the Consultwebs Newsletter here –>SUBSCRIBE<—


Ep 53 – The Millennial Legal Consumer

On the show today we talk about millennials and consumer behaviors and how to get those damn kids of our lawns with an article from, and then we talk with Nika Kabiri from Lux Insights about the research she’s done and how to reach the new digital generation of millennial legal consumers.

What Millennials Expect From Attorneys

Today’s Hot Take is an article from the LawPracticeToday called “What Millennials Expect From Attorneys” by Jean Clauson. In it, she writes:

“Millennials have surpassed baby boomers to become the largest age group in the United States. Pew Research Center anticipates the group will continue growing as a percentage of the overall labor force and will peak in 2036 at 76.2 million.

Don’t make the mistake of imagining millennials are too young to impact your practice: this generation was born between 1981 and 1996, meaning the oldest millennials are in their mid-30s now. This age group will eventually become the majority of your client base if it hasn’t already. That’s why attorneys need to understand millennials’ preferences, habits, and expectations.”

There are four main points included in the article, which are :

1. Millennials prefer to work with attorneys face-to-face.
2. Millennials expect you to be available through a wide variety of communication channels
3. Millennials want to know what they’re getting for their money.
4. Millennials may need help identifying a need for your services beyond serious legal issues.

What we are finding here is that this generation is a bit more focused on the service as opposed to the relationship. They have a task that needs to be completed and will rely on what they know to research and find help with the completion of it. However, there are still expectations that are universal across all legal consumers – for example, the preference of discussing case details in person is not exclusive to millennials. So it’s important to understand what changes and what stays the same with regards to how you reach different generations of law firm clients. Check out the full article here:

Legal Consumer Behavior and Strategic Insights

Nika Kabiri is vice president at Lux Insights, a market research agency that helps companies grow and shape their brands. Nika received her PhD and Masters in Sociology at the University of Washington, and also has a JD from the University of Texas School of Law. With a decade of experience leading research projects for clients in the legal, retail, tech, and non-profit sectors, including a stop as Director of Strategic Insights at Avvo, Nika brings a unique combination of market research expertise and rigorous academic training to her work.

Is Tv Dead? What Successful Law Firm Advertising Aimed Towards Millennials Would Look Like.

In this excerpt from the podcast Jake and Paul talk with Nika about the changing nature of legal advertising, the effect it’s having on traditional marketing approaches like television and what the future of law firm advertising might look like from a consumer insights standpoint:

Jake: So, moving on, millennials, as we know them, they’re killing napkins. They’re killing straws. They’re killing everything that we love as far as fast food’s concerned. So are millennials gonna pull, like are they going to put the final nail in the coffin for lawyers who advertise on TV? Is TV lawyer going the way of the dodo? And then do you have any thoughts on what successful advertising aimed towards millennials would look like from a lawyer or a law firm?

Nika: That’s a great, great question.

Jake: Isn’t that? That’s Paul’s question.

Nika: That’s an excellent question, I love this question. It’s interesting because it’s not just true of the legal profession. It’s like anyone who wants to advertise these days, if they’re advertising on TV, they’re competing with the fact that people browse the internet while they’re watching television. Like, they’re online, they’re on Facebook, their attention is divided. So more and more TV advertising is becoming less and less sticky and online advertising is resonating more.

But with that said, millennials are a lot more likely to want to go to information and learn things in an organic way than they are likely to respond to traditional advertising. Which is why, for instance, native content is really, really valuable. So my recommendation to a lawyer would be, if you don’t really want to spend all that money on TV advertising and if you really do want to target millennials, think about creating content, writing an article and then having it be sponsored somewhere and pay to have it show up somewhere where people will read it and have millennials come to you because you have information you want to share as opposed to saying, “Hey, look how great I am. Do you need a lawyer? Come hire me.”

Jake: That’s awesome.

Paul: So I have a real quick follow-up.

Jake: It’s all real quick follow-ups.

Paul: It’s real quick. Do you think there’s a backlash or an adverse effect, particularly with a younger generation of… if we look at cord cutters and that group, you know, [do they see] people who are advertising on YouTube or Hulu or something like that, like, “Hey, you’re invasive”? Do you kind of feel that maybe having something like content would be a better approach as opposed to, here’s this guy with his arms folded in front of a bookcase?

Nika: Yeah, I think millennials can see through the BS pretty well. I think they’re like… they’re so informed. They have so much more information available to them than any other generation. And, they grew up in this environment where, Occupy Wall Street was happening and, critical challenge of the establishment was just something that was going on. And so it’s not easy to pull the wool over their eyes. They kind of want things to seem natural and real. They don’t want to be pitched to in an inauthentic way. Authentic is really where it’s at, so, and they can kind of see right through that. And thanks to that, I think older generations are kind of being a little bit more aware of the BS, too.

Get More Information About Marketing To The Millennial Legal Consumer

Be sure to listen to the entire podcast episode for more insights and thoughts about millennials, advertising, and keeping your marketing relevant for the younger generations. If you want more LAWsome subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast platform, and for the latest in legal marketing insights and information be sure to subscribe to the Consultwebs Newsletter here –>SUBSCRIBE<—

Ep 51 – A LAWsome New Year

We look forward to the New Year and talk about some trends, topics, and episodes to keep an ear out for and we highlight five legal marketing trends we’ll keep an eye on in 2019.







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Ep 48 – Mass Media vs. Digital Advertising for Lawyers

We dip into a recent Nielsen survey to discover how tv, digital and social media is consumed, where it’s most watched and what this all means to law firms, and then we break it all down and build it back up as we talk about mass media vs digital video advertising for lawyers with Consultwebs Digital Advertising Advisor, Matt Smyers.








People Are Consuming More Digital Media – Particularly Digital Video

Our Hot Take comes from Nielsen Insights, and it’s titled “Time Flies: U.S. Adults Now Spend Nearly Half A Day Interacting With Media.” According to Nielsen, “Platforms that utilize video content represent a substantial portion of time spent with media. Overall video use—time spent with a TV set, computer video and using video focused app/web on smartphones and tablets—netted out to nearly six hours per day for U.S. adults during first-quarter 2018.”








There is a ton of demographics information and graphs in this article, and it is fascinating to see the trends begin to shift more towards video on demand, streaming and social media shares – all of which show that people aren’t going to be using more video “in the future” or “someday” – they are doing it now, and the time to get involved with this is today, which is what we talk to Matt Smyers about. Check out the full article here:

Creating Video Marketing Opportunities for Lawyers

Our guest on the show today is Matt Smyers. He is a non-practicing attorney who brings more than 10 years of experience in the legal marketing industry to his role as a Digital Advertising Advisor at Consultwebs. He earned his B.A. in Political Science from Juniata College and his J.D. from Widner University School of Law.

His unique perspective as a lawyer, legal marketer and business owner makes it easy for him to relate to the challenges clients face when it comes to the balance between practicing law and running a business, and his in-depth knowledge of advertising channels, mass media and digital platforms, make him the perfect victim to answer our questions today.

How We Consume Digital Content Has Changed, And What That Means For Law Firms

In this excerpt from the podcast Jake and Paul talk with Matt about how it seems that video content – particularly digital video content – is expanding, and how “the future is now” now video advertising for law firms:

Jake: So, talking about the digital side of things, when we talk about changing digital media consumption habits, people are not watching TV or they’re watching all the TV or, you know, no one has attention spans but somehow, they can watch eight hours of “Game of Thrones.” Like, explain that. Why does focusing on media consumption happen so now they change? Why does that matter for lawyers and law firms? And what’s going on today?

Matt: Yeah. I mean, wow, how things have changed. Right? You know, just kinda going back to my previous point about in my early days, convincing law firms that they should have a website. And again, for context, that was 10 years ago.

And I think what’s been fascinating to observe over really the last two to three years, in my opinion, is that things like online video were being looked at four or five, six years ago, really since I’ve been involved in digital marketing for law firms. They were being looked at a sort of the, “Well, someday that’ll be cool.”

The challenge was that the audience wasn’t there yet. Right? There just weren’t enough people to justify trying to go out and put your message out there through that medium. And I think the other thought process or common belief at the time was that that’s more…you know, we’ll worry about that when my kids become old enough to buy our services, when they become our prospective clients.

And I think what’s happened over the past couple of years, and I’ll be curious to hear you guys’ take on this, is that what we used to look at as maybe like my kid’s media consumption habits, and how they take in content from whatever screen that might be, is no longer just applicable to them.

And our habits have changed – we were just talking about this the other day. Taking a look in my own personal television viewing habits, as an example. I rarely watch live television anymore, as I think is true of a lot of people, unless it’s a must-see live event. And even then, usually, for me, it’s a sporting event. Even then, I’m probably recording it and watching it later and flying through the commercials because I know I can watch a three-and-a-half-hour football game in an hour.

And if I am watching a live event, I find myself multi-screening now. The event’s in front of me on the television and I have my phone and I’m checking email or I’m on social media or what have you. And those are just some little examples of how the habits are changing.

But I think what has created this sense of urgency around things like online video is that it’s no longer something we’re looking at 5, 10 years down the road because it’s started to impact, in our case, the decision makers within law firms because they’re observing their own behaviors and saying, “Oh, yeah. I can see where, TV might be tough. And we need to start looking at this now,” because they are personally spending more time on their mobile device and, you know, watching…using Netflix and watching videos on YouTube.” And I think it’s now starting to sink in with our client base (lawyers) that, “You know, this is now and we need to get out in front this.”

Get More Information About Digital Advertising and YouTube Advertising for Law Firms – Free Video Advertising Analysis:

Consultwebs is working with a handful of law firms to launch digital advertising campaigns that take advantage of the latest full-suite of video ad-tech  from Google and YouTube.

If you’re interested in having an discussion with Matt Smyers and getting individual consultation and strategy sessions for your law firm, you can connect with him directly here:

Be sure to listen to the entire podcast episode for more insights and thoughts about digital advertising, Youtube and video advertising for lawyers. If you want more LAWsome subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast platform, and for the latest in legal marketing insights and information be sure to subscribe to the Consultwebs Newsletter here –>SUBSCRIBE<—



Ep 42 – Video for Law Firms – Legal Marketing In Motion

On the show today we talk about the power of law firm video advertising and sit down with the founder of Crisp Video Group, Michael Mogill to discover what it takes to make game changing videos for lawyers. Read More

Ep 41- On Legal Marketing

Today we talk about legal marketing mistakes in an article from Forbes, and sit down with lawyer and PILMMA legal marketing legend, Ken Hardison, to discuss what it takes to successfully market a law firm while running it.









Ep 39 – Understanding Legal Marketing & Advertising

Learn how lawyers can work ON their business rather than IN their business with an article by Master Legal Marketer Harlan Schillinger, and sit down with the author/legend himself and discover the differences between advertising and marketing, plus hear some hard truths about law firm intake.








Ep 38 – Storytelling for Lawyers

The art of storytelling overlaps and intersects with the law – in this episode we interview Adrian Samuel and discuss the many ways lawyers can use storytelling to enhance their practice and expand their brand.










Ep 37 – The LAWsome Guide to Copywriting; Writing Better Legal Ads

Word making is hard. We talk about advertising language and good copywriting with an article from, and then we hit the roundtable for a discussion amongst ourselves on what it takes to craft good sales copy for law firms!


The LAWsome Guide to CopywritingFree Download HERE!

. . . also mentioned in the show . . .
– Ray Edwards “How to Write Copy that Sells” is AMAZING!

What is Good Legal Ad Copy?

What’s wrong with just saying, ”I’m a lawyer, call me?” On it’s own, nothing. However, there are going to be many people, particularly in the competitive legal vertical, who are running ads as well, and they probably all say something similar.

You need to draw people’s attention away from them and back to you. And there are time-tested principles and methods you can use to accomplish that.

First, let’s look at the mechanics of advertising, which can be broken down into the following components:

  • Aim  – What do people want, and how do they ask for it? This is your potential client’s intent. Think of search terms as well as practice area keywords (accident, divorce, personal injury).
  • Audience – Demographics – are you speaking to the victim or the victim’s loved one? The language in an advertisement is aimed at converting potential clients. It’s important for legal marketers to create ad copy that resonates with an audience, not live up to the lawyer’s expectations of what an ad should be.
  • Action – What action do you want the audience to take? Is this advertisement about “branding,” or is this about “intent”? Brand awareness advertising accesses a different part of your brain. Direct response ad is aimed at intent. Someone needs a thing, and you have the thing they need just a click away!
  • Differentiation – There is no “safety in numbers” when it comes to advertising. You have to do something different, but not so different it puts people off. The word and language choices you make in your ads are where this can happen. We’ll get to that next.

Consultwebs digital marketing for lawyers

The Mechanics of an Ad

Now that we have some “big picture” items out of the way, let’s get down to the actual craftsmanship involved in ad copywriting. It’s import to acknowledge the many different types of ads –  everything from video to text to banner to social – but the “big 2” in Google are search and display.

Display ads use images and are typically more “brand” or “item” focused, while search ads do not use images, and can be found above the search results in Google. Therefore these ads are more focused on intent.

We are not going to talk about display ads here, although there is some crossover with regard to writing headlines. So, how do you write compelling, effective search ads? The simple answer is that, as lawyers, on a certain level you get paid to be writers. Play to your strengths – language, composition – and use some of the tips below to help inject your command of language into compelling ad copy.

  • Make a list – It takes a lot of ideas and variations. Most will end up in the garbage, but that’s not the point. The point is to write down everything no matter how weird it is.
  • Use writing prompts – Things don’t always just pop in to my head. There are plenty of places to get inspiration and ideas from – even competitor’s ads. Phrases like “10 Secrets of …” or incorporating words like “professional, innovative, practical,” are good ways to get the ideas flowing. Your final revision may not contain any of them, and that’s fine.
  • Format – This is one of my favorites. Think like Dr. Seuss and make it rhyme, or use an if/then statement for example. Putting some parameters or limitations on what you can do can lead to surprising creative results.
  • Framing – What’s the angle here? David versus Goliath, fear of loss, urgency – these are all different approaches that can help you shape the tone and language of an ad.

More on the original Consultwebs post written by Paul Julius – HERE